Pastor's Piece

The Senior Pastor writes his Pastor's Piece each week to connect with the St Alban's Community and its Alumni. This section of the website contains the current and past editions.

Two Coming Events

Sunday, October 13, 2013

A warm welcome to St Albans, especially if you are visiting us on holiday.  I want to tell you about the last two major events we are hosting this year to aid you in your discipleship.

Next Saturday from 3-6pm our mission partners from Hamilton will lead a workshop called ‘Muslims, God and Me’.  They lived and worked among Muslim people in Asia for 8 years and are well qualified to share their insights. They now select and train candidates for cross-cultural mission with the WEC (World Evangelisation for Christ) mission, started by famous English missionary C.T. Studd who served with the ‘Cambridge Seven’ in China from 1885.  These seven were men from upper class society who were educated at Cambridge University and who turned chose purpose over privilege to serve God in overseas mission.  Studd later served in India then Africa, where he founded WEC.

The workshop will examine Islam’s beginnings, main beliefs & practices and its current worldwide status and trends.  Then they will explore some of the key obstacles and attractions to the gospel and how we can share our message and foster lasting and enjoyable relationships with Muslim people.  The workshop will be suitable for people of 16 years and over.  The workshop will finish with a shared dinner at 6pm. This is only a 4 hour event...can you join us and benefit from their experience?

On Saturday November 2nd, St Albans will host the second and final Presbytery Central Gathering from 10.30am to 5pm, finishing with a dinner and after dinner speaker at the Kingsgate Hotel.  The theme is “From Seed to Harvest” preparing for the opportunities in the 2014 Bicentenary Year.  There will be three main speakers:  Rev Dr Mark Keown (Lecturer in New Testament at Laidlaw College), Rev Wayne Te Kaawa (Moderator of the Presbyterian Maori Synod) and Dave Mann (Coordinator of the Hope Project).

There will also be two sessions of workshops on the following topics:

· Learning from a New Micro-church Experiment in Taranaki

· 'Grey Matter': children's brains and children’s ministry

· Understanding our changed Kiwi Context

· Presbyterian Women Aotearoa New Zealand (formerly APW) is changing, with a vision to encourage and empower all women in the church.

· Generation Y: Seven factors that have made 18-30yr olds the way they are and what the church needs to do about it (Murray Brown)

· Evangelism Then and Now – how the gospel initially spread and what it teaches us today.

· How to tell Kiwis Your Faith Story & God’s Big Story

· Church Preschool Outreach Programmes

· Starting or Stuck?  Ten tips on how to establish or revitalize a youth ministry (Murray Brown)

· What’s God Up to On Planet Earth?

· Two workshops about mission among Maori

You can attend from 10.30am to 5pm for $20; and also attend the dinner and after-dinner speaker Wayne Te Kaawa for $45.

I hope you can join us.


Annual Report from Beit Immanuel

Saturday, October 5, 2013

 As we begin the Jewish New Year here in Tel Aviv, Israel, we would like to give a brief report on our past year.  We hope that you will be encouraged by all that we have accomplished with the prayers and support of faithful friends like yourself. For this we thank God.

 Our Children:  Every Friday evening we meet for worship and to light the traditional Shabbat [Sabbath] candles and pray the blessings over wine and bread.  We remind ourselves after a busy week that all that we have comes from our heavenly father and we are thankful.  We invite all children to receive a Shabbat blessing. We want the children to know they are special and that our congregation is praying for them.

 This year we have 5 classes for children with 2 teachers in each. We have focussed on them developing personal faith in God.  We train them to look to God for help, to pray for their own needs and to read God's word on their own. It is surprising how often children are mentioned in the Bible!  We also have regular parent-child activities to build closer family relationships.  Our teachers meet every six weeks for prayer and training, and use plays, quizzes and songs with the children.

 During the holidays we take the children, parents & teachers on trips and activities. Living in the Land of the Bible allows us to visit key places and helps strengthen the faith of our children.  This year we will continue with music and singing lessons for the children.

 Our Youth Group meets fortnightly in a home group and on alternative weeks joins with youth from other local congregations. We encourage them to participate in local and nationwide Messianic events.  In our congregation, youth take an active part in teaching children, leading in worship, equipment set-up and preparing food.  We also encourage them to be active in society like visiting Holocaust survivors to bring comfort and practical help around their properties.

It was joyful to see some young people commit their lives to God in baptism.  After a preparation course we had a special meeting for all the parents to bless and pray for their sons and daughters who gave their lives to the Lord.

Each year we have Bar/Bat Mitzvah celebration in families and community as our young people transition from child to young adult.  On most occasions these are great opportunities for our young people to make a public dedication of their lives to the Messiah Yeshua.

 We have bi-monthly Men’s Meetings to discuss the biblical role of the man in the family and how to care and provide for the family.  They also meet regularly to pray for one another.

 We also have focuses on supporting single people during holiday time which can be especially lonely and supporting single parent families.  Our congregation helps with camp subsidies, food stamps, apartment repairs, school books, clothing etc.  We also provide support groups lead by a trained counsellor, for the mothers and their children with teaching and prayer sessions geared specifically for their needs.


Abba/Pastor David Lazarus

AGM Feedback and More

Saturday, September 28, 2013

Thank you to all who stayed for and participated in our AGM last Sunday.  We had some helpful discussions about our church’s life and mission.  Elders Raymond Hansen and Satyendra Ram were strongly endorsed for another three year term.  Appreciation was expressed for our staff team and leaders of various ministries.

There was discussion about our church website and I have updated the pages under the ‘Groups’ tab including the Women’s Ministry.  These pages will be further updated and improved in the near future.  I have also added the Evergreens group to various lists of regular activities.

The meeting made the following suggestions about our website:

That we establish a St Albans Facebook page.  The Buzz Holiday Programme and Element Youth already have their own Facebook pages.

That we use the calendar on the website under the ‘Events’ tab to advertise events at a much earlier stage to allow people to plan their involvements well ahead.

That the sermon audio recordings on the website be converted to a podcast format.

Our webmaster Kuda Dube also asked for others with web expertise to join his website team.  If you want to help, please contact him at: or 021 124 7012.  There has been one offer already!

Two other suggestions included:

That key leaders meet to discuss ways of engaging children and teenagers in our Sunday morning services that connects them better with the adult congregation.

That during Morning Tea after church, we set up some tables in the Hall for people to sit at where it is quieter and less busy.

The Finance Team apologised for three incorrect figures on the pie charts in their report.  The correct figures are as follows so please correct them in your Annual Report booklet:

INCOME 2012:  Item - Hall hire, Interest etc ($18,307) 4% of Total Income.

EXPENDITURE 2012:  Item – Mortgage Servicing, Principal & Interest ($64,260) 17% of Total Expenditure

EXPENDITURE 2013:  Item – Mortgage Servicing, Principal & Interest ($68, 860) 18% of Total Expenditure

Next Weekend is the Element Youth Camp at Ngatiawa Community, near Rikiorangi in the hills of Waikanae.  Ngatiawa was formerly a Presbyterian campsite which was sold to the Urban Vision Community 20 years ago, who minister to street people and at-risk youth in Wellington city.  New Anglican Bishop Justin Duckworth and his wife Jenny were founders of this community which serves as a place of retreat and refreshment for the Urban Vision community in Wellington. 

The camp will run from Friday afternoon until Sunday dinner time, and our Youth Group invite anyone who wishes to come and visit or sleep over with them.  Please contact Jeff.

Congratulations to Mike, Ben, Mariah & Gabrielle Clark who became NZ Citizens at a ceremony at the Convention Centre on September 12th.  Real Kiwis now!!



Help Bring Hope to Kiwis

Sunday, September 15, 2013

A warm welcome to St Albans as we worship God together and support one another in our living for Jesus. 

I’ve promoted the Hope Project this year with its aim to put the gospel message into every NZ home during 2014, along with a media campaign, to celebrate the Bicentenary of the Gospel coming to NZ on Christmas Day 1814.

Last time I wrote the Hope Project was well behind the $1.2 million they needed to make this happen.  They had only $300,000 at their deadline of July 31st.  However, after extensive promotion, another $350,000 was donated or pledged during August!  Praise God for that! 

This big response encouraged the Hope Project team to continue on their path but they trimmed their budget to $1 million and may delay the distribution of the three gospel booklets from Lent 2014 to perhaps October.  They need more time to prepare the media campaign materials which they cannot start until they have the money to spend.  This all makes good sense to me and I don’t believe it will limit the potential effectiveness of the project at all.

The Hope Project is still seeking donations and pledges for this bicentenary project and promise a complete refund of all gifts given since August 1st if the project should not proceed for any reason.  You can contribute through their website:

Their website has much more information, resources and video clips about their vision “To share the reasons for the hope we have in Christ (1 Peter 3:15) with every home in New Zealand in the weeks leading up to Easter 2014 through TV adverts, booklets, a gospel website and the prayers and conversations of Christian people”.

Yesterday we hosted the Evangelism Conference which is part of the strategy to better equip and motivate followers of Jesus to pray and prepare for next year’s campaign.  This conference was held in Hamilton on the previous Saturday and other Conferences will be held in Hawke’s Bay, Dunedin and near Christchurch.

Coming soon – Understanding Muslims better.

Following the success of last year’s workshop ‘My Neighbours are Weird’ led by our Mission Partner from Hamilton will be back on the weekend of October 19 & 20 to lead another workshop on “Muslims, Me and God”.  This will again be a Saturday workshop, from 3pm to 6pm, finishing with dinner together.  They will also bring three missionary candidates from the current WEC Candidates Course which they lead at east West College in Gordonton, near Hamilton.

Our Annual General Meeting is next Sunday, after a one-hour service at 10am.  I hope you will make the time to join us to reflect on the past year, encourage our leaders and ask your questions about our church’s life and mission.  We hope the meeting will be no more than an hour!


Vote for the Welfare of our City

Sunday, September 8, 2013


A warm welcome to St Albans as we worship God together and support one another in our living for Jesus.  We are one part of Christ’s body in our city, working together with other churches to serve God’s mission.

We have hosted Christ Sanctuary Church on Sunday afternoons for the past year because they have been unable to find a permanent Sunday morning home.  Today is their last service at St Alban’s as they have found a Sunday morning home at the YMCA on Park Road.  We pray that God will work out his purposes through Christ Sanctuary. 

Local Body Elections are fast approaching – for the PN City Council, Mid-Central District Health Board and Horizons Regional Council.  This year there are no Ward areas for the City Council Elections, so we are asked to elect 15 councillors.  Voting will be by Single Transferrable Vote (STV) except for the DHB.  This means we are invited to rank as many candidates as we wish in our order of preference.

I attended the candidates’ meeting in the Convention Centre last week and was very impressed by the number of people willing to serve their community.  They were not all as polished and confident as some but had a heart for our city, concerns about our city and wanted to make a positive difference.  Sadly there were not many candidates of non-European ethnicity.

I was especially encouraged that there were many Christians willing to get involved in local body politics and to engage with their communities.... including our own Marilyn Korte.  Actually, as the 16th out of 33 candidates, Marilyn stole the show with her creative “Once upon a time....” story about challenges currently facing Palmy!

Rates, Rubbish & Rivers; Water, Waste & Walkways; Drugs, Disability & Debt; Parks, People & Parking meters.  Community, Culture & Council’s role.  These are recurring themes in our city.

You can learn more about all the candidates, their policies and personal profiles, by going to  They will also be available at the Election Expo this Tuesday night between 5.30pm and 8.30pm at the Convention Centre.  They will not be making speeches but will be available to speak with voters about any issues.  During the evening the Electoral Officer Dr John Annabell will also explain the voting process of STV.

God told the Jewish people through the prophet Jeremiah, in the midst of their foreign environment of Babylon city, “to work for the peace and prosperity of the city where I sent you into exile.  Pray to the Lord for it, for its welfare will determine your welfare.”  How much more should we seek our city’s welfare!  The Jewish people, even the Babylonian people, would never have dreamed of having a vote for their leaders! 

Let us seek the peace, prosperity and welfare of our city and its people, by exercising the vote we are so blessed to have.... and to learn all we can about the candidates to make an informed vote.  Last election more than half our city’s voters didn’t bother.


Visiting Vanuatu

Sunday, September 1, 2013

It’s good to be back among you!  Shirley and I had an interesting and worthwhile time.  As always, it was the people and their stories that made the trip so worthwhile... from curried squid and coconut crab to a witchdoctor turning to Christ, the challenges facing the Ni-Van youth to remembering the sacrifices of missionaries, and being encouraged by the training that young Presbyterian and Anglican ministers are receiving.  And of course spending time with the Levys and appreciating the gifts and generosity they express in Jesus’ name at Talua Ministry Training Centre.

The Levys are well and cheerful.  Paula’s fulltime teaching, Roger’s building and repair skills, their tutoring of David and Grace in their Correspondence Schooling, and a lively three and a half year old Joshie, make life very full!  And getting the weekly groceries means hiring the Talua truck (ute) when its available and taking an hour to drive the 35 kms into town, on such a bad road that you cannot do more than 30km per hour most of the way!  The exciting rumour is that their road may be sealed half of the way next year.  They will believe it when it happens!  The new kindergarten and water tank, Roger’s shed and upstairs classroom, plus their solar power system and endless repairs of equipment, are a tribute to Roger’s skills and project management.

David and Grace are delightful kids - both doing well in school-work, relating well with the locals, swim and snorkel like adults, walk long distances and travel comfortably on the back of a truck whatever the number of passengers.  David is an avid reader, Grace walks places in bare feet (over sharp coral rock) where even the locals wear jandals, and their Bislama (Pidgin English) is praised by the locals.  For Josh, Bislama is his first language, and he happily spends weekends on a nearby island with the family of their first housekeeper who speak mainly Bislama.  He had to try hard to speak to us in English!

The Talua community is large with about 75 students, 13 staff, and their families, so plenty of children and teenagers around.  David & Grace attend the local Tata School (Years 1 to 10) on two days each week, which is about 25 minutes walk away.

The Levys are valued for the skills they bring but also for their friendliness, generosity and open home which the students and staff feel comfortable to visit.  They are Kiwi Christians at their best!

I was impressed with the training for ordained ministry that Talua provides, even if the daily routine of banging gongs at 5am for devotions, 6am for breakfast, 7am for chapel and 7.30am for lectures was hard to adjust to!!  Their Principal, Pastor Fiama, is an impressive and Spirit-filled man who is open to new ways of training and offers Bible-based and contextualised academic and practical teaching, critical thinking and spiritual formation.  He was very appreciative of my lectures on Leadership in the church, family and denomination, and the sharing from my experience.  Thank you for your prayers and support.



Why is that in the bible?

Sunday, August 25, 2013

Recently, I have been exploring bible stories in depth.   A bible story well known to many is Noah and his boat.  Discussing this story in our English bible study class earlier this month, new insights were exposed both when I explained the grammar and vocabulary, and when learners commented or asked questions.

How big a boat did Noah need?

The story is about Noah saving the animals not about the size of the boat, right?  The actual size may seem unimportant for the story, so let’s just skip over Genesis 6:15 (the verse with that information).  This is how I have glossed over verses when reading alone.  I started to do this in class.  I can’t imagine 150 metres long, 25 metres wide, and 15 metres high anyway.  But then I wondered if I don’t know what that means, why did God bother recording it?  While some people can imagine those dimensions, all of us can think about God being specific about those dimensions and realise that God did not leave Noah to guess.  Together we learned that when God asks us to do something we are not left to our own devices.  He provides us with all the information we need.

How long were Noah and his family on that boat?

Repeatedly the story tells us about 40 days and nights of rain.  Was that all?  No it wasn’t 40 days.  Five months were spent in that boat!  Previously, reading 150 days had had no impact.  The first and last dates are specifically mentioned.  Why?  Rather than glossing over these dates, in the rush to get to the ‘important bits’, we considered life on board for five months.  Five months with nothing to see but each other and animals.  Nothing to do, except feed animals and clean up for five months.  Where did they go to let off steam after an argument?  For five months there was nowhere to go, except walk 150 meters to the end of the boat once more.  Imagine never getting away from the noise and increasing smell of all those animals.  Not exactly a luxury cruise, even if it was the size of a three storey liner.  I am quite happy that I was not in Noah’s family!

Escape at last!

When he got off the boat, Noah built an altar.  Well of course.  He was a Godly man and that’s what people did in the Old Testament.  So let’s just skip on to the next part.  But thinking about it, maybe he was more a relieved man at that moment.  He wanted to say thank you to God for saving him from the flood but also from saving him from that boat.  After five months he had land under his feet again.  That is certainly worth praising God for.  There must have been moments in those five months when this family wondered if they too would sink below the waves, or float over the drowned world forever.

I am discovering treasures in the scriptures that I have just skimmed over before.  Don’t skip the ‘unimportant’.  Ask yourself and others why God put that into scripture.  Think deeply.  AND THEN share what you have learned with someone next week and the next week …  Let’s get excited about what we read, think and learn.  I would love to hear what you have found hidden away in the phrases that are ‘less important’.

Rosalind Austin

Conversational English Teacher

Christian Life

Sunday, August 18, 2013

It is hard to distinctively provide metrics of movement for Christian maturation.  In my experience I have come to observe that God’s way is less of a straight line and looks more like the path of a confused ant!   However, two marks of a Christian life are: 

Intentionality: Are we becoming more aware of our environment and envisioning ourselves as agents of change, are we fostering community with each other and being less self absorbed and continually surrendering to God’s Lordship and leadership?

Fringe: Are we participating with the margins, inviting the misfits and leveraging the resources that God has blessed us with to affirm people’s destiny in God and humanness?

As Christians, we are a people called and commissioned to enact God’s future in the present by thinking and practicing the counter-cultural gospel narrative of being the salt and the light.  As we anticipate in faith and in hope for God to bring His Kingdom fully on earth we are to continually engaging in these four spiritual practices:

Think Relationships

Relationships are a witness to God’s reality - Jesus says they shall know you are my disciples by the way you love one another.  We tend to think of relationships as a means to an end, a leverage to take someone somewhere else.  Maybe we need to begin to think of relationships as an end in themselves.  Relationship as a location where God moves and dwells Lord, Lord when did we see you - when you shared in the lives of the neighbor… Matthew 25. 

Our sharing with each other becomes the vent of divine encounter whenever two or three are gathered, God is… So we need to make a transition from using people to enjoying and celebrating people; having this realization that people are not resources but people are human beings created in the image and likeness of God. 

Think Hospitality

The litmus test of how we are doing as a Christian is not when we love those who love and agree with us but when we make space, and respond with love to those we deem as enemies; those who hate and persecute us.   We are called to practice hospitality in a culture that is framed in individualism rather than communalism.  God himself has made space for you and me, not on merit but by Grace and Love - while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.  We are reconciled with God, so we are charged with a ministry of reconciliation.  We are to make space for a stranger, someone other than us:  People from other faith traditions, different political spectrums, different races or even different sexual orientation.

Think Generosity

We serve a God who is generous and liberal - He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good and sends rain to the righteous and unrighteous…  We need to begin to think of generosity not only in terms of how much we give away, but that which we get to keep.  How do we spend it?  Instead of merely aiming to balance the books, maybe we need to rediscover faithfulness; faithfulness with our money, with our time and life.

Think Prayer

What is your default posture when you hit a boundary?  Do you take Aspirin?  Do you turn to anger and manipulation, or fear and control?  May I invite us to take up prayer as our go to behavior.  James has this to say about prayer - Is anyone among you in trouble?  Let them pray…  Prayer becomes the place we encounter the incarnate God who enters deeply and suffers, or even rejoices, with us.  Prayer becomes the avenue where God’s Spirit empowers us and works through us.

Jeff Odhiambo

Youth Pastor


Sunday, August 11, 2013

What makes our Christian faith unique is the belief that our God is a family.  Our God is a community of persons, a fellowship of love.  In love God has absorbed us in that union, the fellowship of Father, Son and Spirit.  Our God doesn’t do abandonment, neither does He do rejection; God’s family is not exclusive but inclusive.

When people think of our church or visit our church do they find a church institution or a family relationship?  Do they find primarily a church building or a family bond?  Have we become merely a local community center that just happens to tell people about Jesus; where adults, teens and children come to participate in their own interests and have their worldview confirmed, in a culture that perpetuates exclusion and ageism?  Or are we a church that is proclaiming the disruptive transformative gospel message of love, a church that is willing to contend and struggle in love together as a family?

Love is attractive and contagious; I think this is why Jesus told his disciples that the world would know what he was all about because of their love for each other.  Imagine a church where the generations love and take care of each other.  Imagine a church where the generations have authentic relationships with each other.  A church engaging in generational unity is a church that is involved in the great commission of making disciples, for without the generations rubbing up against each other and knowing each other those covenantal and formational relationships will never happen.

As we continue to make transitions from an age-stratified congregation to a more inter-generational faith community here is some of my suggestions for that movement:

Adopt - a grandparent - Call upon our youth to adopt an elder member of our congregation and invite them to show that person special care.  This could include sitting with them in worship, inviting them to come to a youth gathering and visiting with them regularly.

Adopt - a youth - The reverse idea works as well.  Invite adults in our congregation to adopt youth and be part of the ministry of nurturing our teens.  I would suggest that these persons not be the same adults who are already serving in our youth ministry programme.

Art and Sport Experiences- Engaging people of all ages in experiences of art-making and sports as this is a great way to break down barriers.  Group projects and games allow everyone to play while providing time for conversations and community-building.

Joint mission trips We do well in youth ministry when we invite the youth to participate and join God in His mission at an early age.

I am advocating for an end of ‘youth mission trips’ and proposing a movement towards mission opportunities that invite all ages in the church to participate.  Nothing builds community faster between ages than travelling together and working side-by- side  to help those In need.

Cross Generational Camps/Retreats - We need spaces for all to eat, play and worship together for a weekend, away from the mundane regular lives, while still providing opportunities for children, teens and adults to spend time in their separate age groupings.

Youth Leadership - One of the best ways for older teens to begin to learn what the real work of church is all about is to invite them to be part of our leadership teams and ministries. Rather than having them sit on the sidelines waiting for some day to take part in the work of the church, we should invite them right now to lend their ideas and voices to our outreach ministries, our worship planning and our Church Council.

Jeff  Odhiambo

Youth Pastor

Bicentenary ‘Gospel in NZ Homes’ Project

Sunday, July 28, 2013

You have heard me speak about and maybe seen the promo DVD of the ‘Jesus – all about hope’ project to put three Gospel booklets in every NZ home during Lent (pre-Easter) in 2014.  These will be accompanied by TV adverts, a Gospel website plus ordinary followers of Jesus like us talking with our neighbours, workmates and friends about the booklets.

The estimated cost of this project is $2 per home ($2.7 million) and it was hoped in faith to raise $1.2 million by July 31st.  They have received $200,000 over the past three months that the Hope Roadshow has been travelling around NZ churches which is very encouraging.  St Albans has given $1300, the untagged portion of our local mission funds at June 30th.  However the figure is well short and a small miracle is required!

In addition to donations, the project has invited pledges, payable at the end of August if sufficient funds are raised through donations plus pledges to proceed.  To make a pledge please email Dave Mann, the Project Hope Coordinator:

Dave writes, “For our team we do not see this project as a nice idea. Instead we see it as something that is necessary, because sharing the Christian message clearly with all peoples is the mission Christ gave us.  As such, this story isn’t over. However, because a postponed project would be very difficult, the best time to do this really is right now!  The option of a down-scaled project is generally not in the picture, because it cannot achieve the goal of our vision statement –

“To share the reasons for the hope we have in Christ (1 Peter 3:15) with every home in New Zealand in the weeks leading up to Easter 2014 (during Lent) through the means stated...”

Every home in NZ will not hear the Christian message in a clear way like this in 2014 without this project (nor have they for 30 years).  The 2014 Bicentenary is our best opportunity for this project – which means we need visionary believers to act right now to help ensure this project proceeds.

Let’s pray together for this – and do what we can.”

Please join in the prayer for this Gospel Project.

Evangelism Conference 2013 – “for all who are scared of evangelism” is part of the Hope Project preparation for 2014 and St Albans will host one of these conferences for our wider region on Saturday September 14th from 9am to 5pm.  It will cost about $20 per person.  Plz mark the date in your calendars.

The conference sessions include: Plight of the lost, Understanding our culture, Conversational skills, Invitational boldness, Telling your story, Effective discipleship (follow up), Simple demonstration of how to share the gospel, Beyond 2014 - toward an evangelistic culture.  There will be four excellent presenters.

Hope Conferences are for believers who are lost as to how to approach evangelism in today’s world; for believers who feel sceptical of the evangelistic methods some still teach; for pastors who feel we need approaches that better suit our times; for Christians who believe in the power of the Gospel - but who don’t know where to start.

This conference will inspire and help prepare us not only for the opportunities in 2014 but for the opportunities that exist every day as we learn the simple art of talking about spiritual things with multi-religious New Zealanders in today’s world.

Shalom, Steve